Is D09c bad for brush-looping?

[TensorBackhand]

Recently I have been testing out the D09c, but I just find it wildly hard to control and a bad fit for my FH loop. I think I tend to brush loop the ball more than hit through. I'm very accustomed to Chinese fh rubbers, and those really fit my technique well.

But the D09c seems bad for my technique. A lot of times, it seems the rubber doesn't catch the ball and it kinda falls down into the net or onto the table. Other times, I try to "fix" this problem and I end up over-compensating and the ball goes wildly long.

Anybody else have experience with D09c? Is it known to be a bad fit for brush-looping?

I also use Dragon Grip a lot, but I don't find DG to have the same problem as D09c. It feels a lot more stable and predictable and seems to catch the ball better.

 

[PaddyPolar]

Maybe you are taking it too late with the Dignics 09c, a shot that is a lot more risky with Dignics compared to a chinese rubber. The slightly and softer sponge may feel different at first, but with some technique changes, it will feel better along the way.

 

[Wrighty67]

I’ve used 09c a lot but never experienced what you describe. I brush the ball a lot when looping so would have noticed. Is your sheet in good condition on the top sheet?

 

[TackyForehand]

The sponge deforms significantly upon impact. Imagine playing with a mini trampoline.

 

[TensorBackhand]

I’ve used 09c a lot but never experienced what you describe. I brush the ball a lot when looping so would have noticed. Is your sheet in good condition on the top sheet?

Yes, good condition, grippy.

 

[Amayzde]

It probably has to do with the different throw angle and sponge.

It sounds like you are not engaging the sponge right. So whenever you hit the net you don’t engage the sponge enough and the ball falls dead. But when you overcompensate you engage the sponge too much and it throws it pit of the table.

You should probably give it some time to get used to and find the right way to hit the ball.

 

[dingyibvs]

The only time I've had issues with brush looping is when it's very cold and humid.

 

[v100ev]

As a long-time user of hard tacky rubbers I really can relate to the OP.
I've been playing with Battle 2 (normal -> Prov -> Nat) for a long time. And I've also tried multiple rubbers (including D09C) and most of them do not feel the same on brush loop. I think being used to a hard-not-very-responsive sponge is the main problem. When I perform a brush loop with the B2 - the contact with the ball is super thin. If I do the same with Hybrid rubbers - in most cases the ball will either slip and fall into the net, or go over the net but with very little spin.
For me the conclusion is that one needs to engage the sponge more with those hybrid rubbers, and also release the ball later (like with hard/dull tacky rubbers you expect fast release and with dynamic hybrid rubbers you should expect a slower release).. Definitely some hybrid rubbers are still better in this aspect than others (like Bluestar A1 was definitely better in this regard for me compared to Hammond Z2.. )
So I would suggest the OP to try to prolongate the brush loop contact (thus engaging the sponge a little more).. should be fine.

 

[banbekas]

Really? As someone who's been using Chinese rubber as my forehand rubber, I brush and spin the ball with 09C quite well. I still get the same amount of spin from the rubber. The only downside I experienced from hybrid rubbers, even 09C, is I don't feel its impact on the sponge as if it doesn't bite the blade, something that I rarely experienced from Chinese rubbers.

My only advice for you is too hit through the sponge when you loop with it. I don't know people's obsession with brushing thinly since I rarely do it. I always hit the sponge with open racket angle and then lift it. It gives you better quality and consistency, imho.

 

[Fnub]

I don't really know how that works. I think you should open your bat angle. D09c has more elastic topsheet than even the DG so for high quality ball it requires the sponge usage.
I have Battle 2 Gold and Blue. Both of them have hard topsheet. So I really have to brush. And there is crazy amount of spin.
Also I have H3 BS 42 Ma Long FH. This one has really soft topsheet. I still can play only brushing but the quality of the ball is bad. So to play properly I have to engage the sponge. To make lots of spin I have to do much more work than with B2.
I suppose you're just used to firmer topsheets. But again I don't completely understand how it works and would be glad if someone tries to explain it to me

 

[kindof99]

D09c is hybrid and hard, so brush looping is probably in the middle of h3 and esn as well

 

[banbekas]

I don't really know how that works. I think you should open your bat angle. D09c has more elastic topsheet than even the DG so for high quality ball it requires the sponge usage.
I have Battle 2 Gold and Blue. Both of them have hard topsheet. So I really have to brush. And there is crazy amount of spin.
Also I have H3 BS 42 Ma Long FH. This one has really soft topsheet. I still can play only brushing but the quality of the ball is bad. So to play properly I have to engage the sponge. To make lots of spin I have to do much more work than with B2.
I suppose you're just used to firmer topsheets. But again I don't completely understand how it works and would be glad if someone tries to explain it to me

For me, I have always loop by compressing the sponge. The only difference is the ball contact and how I hit it. Upward movement for lifting backspin and forward to give more force and end the point.
Even when I tried my friend's 09C, I don't really feel that much difference from my usual rubber aside from the fact that I don't really feel the usual compression that I always get from Chinese rubbers. It's like using Omega 7 Yin for me. Just a disgusting feel, lol.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I think there is clearly nothing wrong with D09C
one of the most uses butterfly rubbers in the semi pro space that I am in.

I suspect, not brushing the ball enough is the problem

 

[ttarc]

@v100ev: Same here. I've also tried many hybrid rubbers and had the same issues. They all want this fuller contact/more sponge/hitting through the ball than rubbers like B2 or H3. Problem (for me) is that they need to be played like this all the time otherwise the shot quality is low(er) or shots go long or in the net. With B2 or H3 I can choose to hit like this but I don't need to do always.

 

[TensorBackhand]

I think there is clearly nothing wrong with D09C
one of the most uses butterfly rubbers in the semi pro space that I am in.

I suspect, not brushing the ball enough is the problem

I didnt say there's something wrong with D09c.

I asked if a specific looping technique might be less compatible with D09c vs tacky Chinese rubbers.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I didnt say there's something wrong with D09c.

I asked if a specific looping technique might be less compatible with D09c vs tacky Chinese rubbers.

yep, and my answer to that is

I think there is clearly nothing wrong with D09C
one of the most use butterfly rubbers in the semi pro space that I am in.

I suspect, not brushing the ball enough is the problem

 

[ander999]

I have a more older European looping style so using hybrid rubbers just doesn't work for me. Maybe you are experiencing the same thing as me?

 

[TensorBackhand]

yep, and my answer to that is

I think there is clearly nothing wrong with D09C
one of the most use butterfly rubbers in the semi pro space that I am in.

I suspect, not brushing the ball enough is the problem

ok, maybe. I need to practice more with D09c to find the correct technique. I personally feel like I am brushing the ball too much and that is somehow incompatible.

The rubber seems to do better when I hit through the ball more.

 

[Okay Angi]

ok, maybe. I need to practice more with D09c to find the correct technique. I personally feel like I am brushing the ball too much and that is somehow incompatible.

The rubber seems to do better when I hit through the ball more.

i have been playing D09c for a while both FH and BH. Just brushing is not consistent with this rubber. I mean when purely brushed u cant catch the ball all time like %50-50 to me. But if you catch the ball with brushing the spin is enormous.

In my opinion first good hitting then slighty brushing (for sponge engagement) is necessary to use d09c properly. Also Fang Bo mentioned the same thing in his videos.

I guess sole brushing is for celluoid balls.

 

[TensorBackhand]

i have been playing D09c for a while both FH and BH. Just brushing is not consistent with this rubber. I mean when purely brushed u cant catch the ball all time like %50-50 to me. But if you catch the ball with brushing the spin is enormous.

In my opinion first good hitting then slighty brushing (for sponge engagement) is necessary to use d09c properly. Also Fang Bo mentioned the same thing in his videos.

I guess sole brushing is for celluoid balls.

ok. So it sounds like I'm not just imagining things with this rubber.

I will do a few more day of practicing with more hitting through